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| Water Drop Photography - Tips and Tricks? | Rating: 
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| Posted by moonlight1811: Tue May 22nd, 2012 21:02 | 1st Post |
| Hello everyone! I am fascinated with photographing water drops. It was the very first project I attempted as soon when I got my camera (Nikon D3100 with 18-55mm lens). I didn't really know what I was doing and just experimented around. I want to try and briefly describe what I did and then get feedback from anyone about how to improve anything. Any tips and tricks are appreciated =] I set up a small bowl filled (about 3/4) with water and placed a colored sheet of paper behind it. Then about 30cm above the bowl, I created a drip. I set my camera to manual, popped up the flash, set my shutter speed to 1/200 and I don't recall what I set the f value to. I think it might have been f6.3. I'm honestly still trying to figure out what that value really does. Any help on that would be appreciated! Once I set all that up and started the drip, I used the tip of a pen and tried to place it exactly where the drop was hitting the water surface. Then I focused on the tip of the pen with auto focus (no tripod), pulled the pen out of the picture, shot and hoped I got something good! The pen thing was a suggestion from a youtube video I found. Some of you are probably cringing while reading this! Any input on how to create a more efficient setup, better/easier focus, or anything else that might be of value would be great to know. I will post two pictures I took in the gallery. This turned out kind of long, sorry about that!
____________________ -Melissa |
| Posted by Robert: Wed May 23rd, 2012 02:42 | 2nd Post |
moonlight1811 wrote:Hello everyone! Thanks for the explanation, no cringing here. Aperture controls the amount of light entering the the camera through the lens. It's just about the most important control on the camera (in my opinion). Not only does it control the amount of light, it also controls the depth of focus. That is how far in front and behind the point of the pen you used to focus on is acceptably sharp. When the lens (aperture) is wide open it lets maximum light through BUT your depth of focus is at it's shortest. When the lens (aperture) is closed right down you get least light and greatest depth of focus. That is fact of life in photography for every lens no matter what. To throw spanner in works... Lenses have a sweet-spot in their aperture range, where the best image quality is usually to be found. In most cases that is usually around f8. Set up a row of bean cans, say 5 or 8 in a line on a table and take a picture along the row focusing on the middle one. Try wide open, then f8 then f16 look if you can see the change in the depth of focus. This is an important lesson to learn, say you are taking a photo of a group of people with the lens wide open, unless they are all the same distance from the camera some will be out of focus. To fix that you need to close the lens down a bit, but not too much because that might make it too dark. By the way we are talking about Aperture priority here, with the top dial set to 'A'. Below I will try to demonstrate the principle. Unfortunately we can only inset one image per post. The images were taken with a D3100 with an 18-105 lens zoomed to about 35mm. at f3.5, f8 and f22. Note the increased depth of focus and the darkening in the background with the smaller apertures. Focus was on the front of the red Ravioli can. Attachment: Cans a f3.5.jpg (Downloaded 64 times)
____________________ Robert. |
| Posted by Robert: Wed May 23rd, 2012 03:01 | 3rd Post |
| Cans at f8. Attachment: Cans a f8.jpg (Downloaded 63 times)
____________________ Robert. |
| Posted by Robert: Wed May 23rd, 2012 03:02 | 4th Post |
| At f22. Attachment: Cans a f22.jpg (Downloaded 63 times)
____________________ Robert. |
| Posted by Robert: Wed May 23rd, 2012 03:14 | 5th Post |
| If you check out the detail ( for example the texture of the worktop) on the last f22 image you may see that it's falling off although much more of the image is acceptably sharp. For me the f8 image is best because the background is better exposed and the background is a bit blurred, forcing the eye to the main subject, the cans. Hope this helps you understand Aperture better. You are best to try it yourself and see the effect at different zoom settings and apertures.
____________________ Robert. |
| Posted by richw: Wed May 23rd, 2012 05:13 | 6th Post |
| Pre-focusing the camera is a good idea for a fast moving subject. You can then play with your shutter release priority to only fire as focus is achieved, this is a technique that is sometimes used with motor sports to get the car in focus at a particular point, or with a subject like a humming bird, but probably wouldn't work for a water droplet. Once the focus is set don't forget to switch to manual (just flick it across on the lens rather than the body) this will then stop the camera re-focusing when you hit the shutter. I have never had a go at water droplets but based on your first effort whatever you are doing seems to work well! I would have guessed that 1/200 was too slow and gone for about 1/500 but seeing the results shows how much I know! How did you time the shot, fast finger or some other method?
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| Posted by moonlight1811: Wed May 23rd, 2012 13:09 | 7th Post |
Robert wrote: Hope this helps you understand Aperture better. You are best to try it yourself and see the effect at different zoom settings and apertures.Robert, This helps A LOT! Thanks so much. Better than any other explanation I have come across. I may try to do the same thing just to experiment around with it. If you set the top dial to 'A', so aperture priority...does that mean you can only manipulate aperture and shutter speed is automatically determined by the camera?
____________________ -Melissa |
| Posted by moonlight1811: Wed May 23rd, 2012 13:14 | 8th Post |
richw wrote: Once the focus is set don't forget to switch to manual (just flick it across on the lens rather than the body) this will then stop the camera re-focusing when you hit the shutter.I would never have thought of switching it to manual once I had set my focus. That's a great tip, thanks! Well, I used my camera's flash...and when my flash is up, the camera won't even allow me to set my shutter speed beyond 1/200. If I push the flash down, I am able to go up in my shutter speed quite a bit, but then when I shot a picture of the water drops, it turned out black. Even after adding a bunch of other light to the setup; without a flash, it was black. So I was pretty much stuck with 1/200. Any ideas on why it would come out black? It makes sense to me that it would be much darker, but not black! I didn't really time it. I tried at first, but I was always either too late or too early. So I took a deep breath, shot when I felt was right, and just hoped for some luck. If you figure out a better method, let me know lol
____________________ -Melissa |
| Posted by Robert: Wed May 23rd, 2012 14:02 | 9th Post |
| Really this sort of photography needs manual focus (MF) because the subject, the droplet, is only visible for a fleeting moment. OK you can use a pen, or a bit of string or some other device but the moment you touch the shutter release the camera's AF system is going to try to find something to focus on. Hence MF, also as I have demonstrated, the depth of focus is limited at close range so it has to be right to get a good sharp image. Shutter speed with focal plane shutters (Flat curtain shutters close to the sensor or film) are limited to 1/200 to 1/250 Sec That is the fasted speed that they are completely open for. The flash has to be timed for that moment when the shutter is wide open. To achieve 'faster' shutter speeds the curtain doesn't move any faster but the second, closing shutter starts to follow the opening shutter, creating a narrower gap between the two shutters. At really high shutter speeds say over 1/1,000 Sec the gap between the blades is a mere slit, exposing the sensor to the image as it passes. So, if you were to be able to cause a flash at the right time, all you would see would be a narrow band of the image because the flash duration is very short well less than 1/1,000 of a second, more likely 1/10,000 of a second or less. If you were to use a medium format camera like some of the Hassleblads which have the shutter built into the lens, then you may be able to get a sync speed of 1/500 Sec. But that's a different ball game! As for the black images... Without knowing what settings you are using it's hard to be sure but I guess the will be far too little light without the flash. Flash may only be very short but it punches out a lot of light. I sometimes photograph books, to get enough light I have two 80w halogen floodlights 12" from the book at each side, and that doesn't give me really short exposures, only just enough light really. Try it in daylight or with sun coming through window?
____________________ Robert. |
| Posted by moonlight1811: Wed May 23rd, 2012 14:35 | 10th Post |
| Manual focus makes more sense. Although a tripod would probably make that much easier and I do not have one of those available right now. I guess I'll put that on my ever growing list of "Camera Accessories I Want". I'm not even going to ask about medium format cameras or Hassleblad. That sounds like an entirely different world right now. It could be that they came out black because of far too little light without the flash. I took the water drop pictures in my kitchen and there's not a window there, so light from outside doesn't really come in. I set up two desk lamps that seemed very bright (to me) but perhaps the camera felt otherwise. Perhaps if I had two super bright lights like you use for your books it would make a difference. Exposure? I keep seeing this word pop up in things I read, but I have yet to find out what it really means.
____________________ -Melissa |
| Posted by Robert: Wed May 23rd, 2012 15:09 | 11th Post |
moonlight1811 wrote:Exposure? I keep seeing this word pop up in things I read, but I have yet to find out what it really means. Exposure, in different contexts means different things... An exposure, to take an image with the camera. The sensor is like film, it records the image which is focused onto it while it is exposed, while the shutter is open. Exposure duration, the shutter speed, the time the sensor is exposed to the image. Exposure (settings) the combination of shutter speed and aperture. Exposure *Stop*, means one step of the shutter speed, or one full step of the aperture. Exposure Value, or EV is a way of altering the shutter speed up and the aperture down (or wider) both move by one stop each normally so for example 1/500 Sec at f8 is the same EV as 1/1000 Sec at f5.6 or 1/2000 at f4 or going the other way 1/250 Sec at f11. I know next to nothing about music but the sounds of instruments double or halve in frequency with each sound value? with light it's much the same, I think? Not sure if that helps... The reason for EV's is so you can open or close the aperture to get the depth of focus you want OR increase or reduce the shutter speed to get the exact speed effect you want, like blurring the spokes of a wheel to show movement or the propellor of an aircraft, to show movement, etc while retaining the same exposure value. The exposure varies with the light. More light, needs less the exposure. Poor light may mean raising the ISO setting on the camera because the sensor just can't produce an image. BUT raising the ISO too much can cause what we call noise, this is electronic noise when the light isn't sufficient to produce an image the sensor tries to amplify the signal and that can cause noise in the form of gritty dots of multi colours. Not very nice.
____________________ Robert. |
| Posted by moonlight1811: Wed May 23rd, 2012 22:48 | 12th Post |
Robert wrote: Exposure, in different contexts means different things...Well, you've stumped me a little. I think I understand, but then I read your explanation again and then I realize that I don't understand. lol I'll get it eventually! I'm determined!
____________________ -Melissa |
| Posted by Robert: Thu May 24th, 2012 01:43 | 13th Post |
| It will all fall into place, once you become familiar with the terminology, it's harder to explain than it really is. Too many things to learn at once. Go take some more pix! That's what really matters. Put some on here and we will help you progress.
____________________ Robert. |
| Posted by Robert: Thu May 24th, 2012 03:31 | 14th Post |
| Been having a bit of a think about this 'Exposure' thing. The image you posted of the water droplet while well executed and very clever, wasn't well exposed it's dull and lacks sparkle. You mentioned iPhoto... So I imported your image into iPhoto on my MBP, which gave me this: Attachment: Screen Shot 2012-05-24 at 08.18.35.png (Downloaded 37 times)
____________________ Robert. |
| Posted by Robert: Thu May 24th, 2012 03:38 | 15th Post |
| Look at the histogram at top right (Levels) The data only covers the first half of the chart, Black is at the left, White to the right. By adjusting the white point it removes the dullness and restores some brilliance to the image. It would have been better if the image had been exposed correctly in camera, it would give you a better tonal range. Here is what happens when you adjust the white point in the levels. Attachment: Screen Shot 2012-05-24 at 08.26.29.png (Downloaded 37 times)
____________________ Robert. |
| Posted by Robert: Thu May 24th, 2012 03:50 | 16th Post |
| OK, that may not be exactly the image you wanted but you can adjust the sliders and make many alterations yourself. This was done in iPhoto 11, 9.2.3 I rarely use iPhoto except for testing but it will do quite a lot if you dig around. Duplicate an image and play with the duplicate, you can't break anything and you can always revert to the original at any time. Look at the settings in the second screen shot, try adjusting the White balance further to blue. Adjust the tones, play around. Getting back to exposure, use the histogram on the back of your camera, you can toggle it on or off with the navigation button, up and down I think. Ideally a well exposed image will have data the full width of the histogram, without the white at the right climbing the wall. That means the whites are over exposed. Use the exposure compensation button to adjust the exposure in aperture mode.
____________________ Robert. |
| Posted by jk: Thu May 24th, 2012 05:38 | 17th Post |
| I think the photo is a very good first attempt. The flash is providing most of the exposure and depending on how strong the ambient light is you get a light/darker background. I think this image would be improved by reshooting at a smaller aperture f16 but this may not beossible with the equipment that Melissa has. When we get the newphoto gallery then we can start maybe to have themed projects/competitions or whatever you want to call them. Really I think that these are an opportunity to challenge yourself to make a photo of a certain subject in a short time frame.
____________________ Still learning after all these years! https://nikondslr.uk/gallery_view.php?user=2&folderid=none |
| Posted by moonlight1811: Thu May 24th, 2012 13:49 | 18th Post |
Robert wrote: OK, that may not be exactly the image you wanted but you can adjust the sliders and make many alterations yourself. This was done in iPhoto 11, 9.2.3It may not have been the exact image I wanted, but it was a good demonstration and I understand more what you mean. I'll have to mess around with iPhoto some more. I think I get the concept of exposure much better, but I'm really unsure of how to adjust it and use it on my camera. Looks like I need to consult the manual and see what it has to say. Although that thing hasn't really been any help so far!
____________________ -Melissa |
| Posted by moonlight1811: Thu May 24th, 2012 13:53 | 19th Post |
jk wrote: I think the photo is a very good first attempt.Thanks, jk. I know there is room for a lot of improvement. I don't really know what the equipment I have is capable of yet to be honest. I need to get out and take more pictures. I'm going on a short trip in two weeks and will hopefully get to then. Projects/competitions! I'm in! Even though I'm not very good...yet! =]
____________________ -Melissa |
| Posted by jk: Sat May 26th, 2012 11:21 | 20th Post |
| I used to be very competitive and played sport at a fairly high level so I find it difficult to translate this into photography except in a sell/buy situation where you are competeing for a customer. I really dont think that open theme competitions are useful unless you want to see other peoples work but I think displaying your photos can do this equally well. I think that providing a brief or theme and shooting to that is more challenging.
____________________ Still learning after all these years! https://nikondslr.uk/gallery_view.php?user=2&folderid=none |
| Posted by jk: Sat May 26th, 2012 11:21 | 21st Post |
| I used to be very competitive and played sport at a fairly high level so I find it difficult to translate this into photography except in a sell/buy situation where you are competeing for a customer. I really dont think that open theme competitions are useful unless you want to see other peoples work but I think displaying your photos can do this equally well. I think that providing a brief or theme and shooting to that is more challenging.
____________________ Still learning after all these years! https://nikondslr.uk/gallery_view.php?user=2&folderid=none |
| Posted by moonlight1811: Sat May 26th, 2012 12:26 | 22nd Post |
| I'm very competitive when it comes to singing, but I never played sports. I think it would just be a fun way to display pictures and make people more driven to produce something good. Doesn't have to be a competition! Maybe just a themed event where people share photos and make comments to each other about them =] Not trying to convince you. Just throwing ideas out there!
____________________ -Melissa |
| Posted by Constable: Sat May 26th, 2012 15:51 | 23rd Post |
| Jk Where are we on the new photo gallery structure? That is the one thing that is not as good as the old site. btw your wanted S2/D800 comparisons are on the Hassy thread here Cheers Ed
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| Posted by jk: Sat May 26th, 2012 20:16 | 24th Post |
Constable wrote:Jk The gallery upgrade is progressling slowly. We cant get enhancements to the cheap one that we got for this forum so at present I am waiting for confirmation that the new proposed software for the gallery is suitable so we have single login and that the install can be carried out by our hosting company. The new gallery will be PhotoPost Pro. It is the best gallery that I can find that integrates with the forum. I hope that we can get the purchas and install made in the next week or so. Thanks for the S2 and D800 tests. Going to take a look after posting this. Got my D800 on Wednesday but I am in UK so I have limited glass to test with. Like the camera controls it is definitely a step up from the D700 but not as solid as a D3.
____________________ Still learning after all these years! https://nikondslr.uk/gallery_view.php?user=2&folderid=none |
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