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blackfox
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moderately happy with the d300s its turning out some good photos recently as you have seen , but in my ever ongoing struggle for better i.q what is the best RAW settings . do I use 12 bit (more fps) or the slightly slower 14 bit do I use lossless compressed/compressed /or uncompressed up till now been shooting in 12 bit lossless compressed I have today tried out 14 bit (tad slow) but can't see that much difference yet , still to process the files though . so is there any advantage or should I just leave good enough alone ??? |
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Eric
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blackfox wrote:moderately happy with the d300s its turning out some good photos recently as you have seen , but in my ever ongoing struggle for better i.q what is the best RAW settings . When I was photographing commercially I always worked in the maximum camera bit depth....and edited at 16bit in Photoshop. Belt an braces! Whilst there is very little difference when comparing ootc shots or even simple edited files, when you start to do lots of processing in Photoshop, coupled with large resampling for posters etc, I feel there is a risk of loosing tonal range. This article shows the difference between 8x16bit....taken to extreme for effect. https://www.photoshopessentials.com/essentials/16-bit/ How much normal editing really shows up these differences, especially on monitors, iPads or small prints is questionable. |
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blackfox
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hmmm thanks for the quick reply Eric , but that doesn't really answer the question , lets put it this way what would you shoot in for wildlife use cant get my head round all the connotations .. processed a few from today and possibly slightly better in 14 bit , but would I be better off simply upgrading the camera body and would that then give a advantage in i.q and focussing ..or is the difference only marginal , I know j.k went from the d300 to the d500 is there that great a difference in what it produces |
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Eric
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blackfox wrote:hmmm thanks for the quick reply Eric , but that doesn't really answer the question , lets put it this way what would you shoot in for wildlife use cant get my head round all the connotations .. processed a few from today and possibly slightly better in 14 bit , but would I be better off simply upgrading the camera body and would that then give a advantage in i.q and focussing ..or is the difference only marginal , I know j.k went from the d300 to the d500 is there that great a difference in what it produces The point I was making, obvious not clearly, was if you want to be absolutely bombproof sure that you get the best possible out of your currrent setup .....you need to shoot at 14bit raw, save the nefs uncompressed and process the files at 16bit. It can't get any better FOR ANY CAMERA. The question is whether the improvement is significant enough for you to put up with slower file handling, more file storage space and longer processing times. You can determine this empirically and only you can say if the benefit is worth it. Personally I think some are overkill. The second part of the question is whether a different camera sensor would be even better. (Of course with another camera you still have the same dilema as to whether 14bit/compressed files are any better on THAT camera.) For my part the D500 is a better camera than the D300 in most ways. And if someone dropped £1500 on your lap tomorrow I am sure you know what choice you would make. The problem is...where do you stop with comparisons? If you lined up a D5, D850, D500 they would all out perform a D300 in most departments. Opinions will differ as to which of those 3 is best (I've read some wildlife people say the D5 is best under low light conditions for example.) |
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blackfox
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cheers Eric , having looked at the funding options open to me for a d500 it will have to go on a back burner for the moment , I don't think I need the i.q from the 14 bit files either .. stick with what I have for the moment I suppose and wait for better weather to come along .. still got the Panasonic g80 and Leica 100-400 to so a bit pointless as i.q wise that's right up there with the d500 and with if required a totally silent shutter . .. |
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Eric
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blackfox wrote:cheers Eric , having looked at the funding options open to me for a d500 it will have to go on a back burner for the moment , I don't think I need the i.q from the 14 bit files either .. stick with what I have for the moment I suppose and wait for better weather to come along .. It's a shame we are not located closer as you would have been welcome to try my D500. Of course if you got better photos out of it than I do, I may then have to kill you.  |
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blackfox
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yep pity . you never know this summer we both have caravans so a crossing of paths is possible .. we will almost certainly have a week or so up bridlington way for bempton cliffs |
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jk
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Hate to say this but my testing has shown that for BIF you need the best AF unit in camera. As Robert said steer away from the D7xxx cameras as they have poorer AF as they are prosumer. In all fairness for all except wildlife and action sports the AF will be good enough. I will post the AF units in each Nikon DSLR from the last 12/15 years in my next post. As Eric says to get best IQ shoot 14bit and in Photoshop save as 16bit TIFF. However nobody will see this quality unless you get it Fuji Frontera processed/printed but if you put on internet then straight away it goes to 8bit sRGB jpg. |
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jk
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Nikon Camera sizes and AF units. Model (MP) Wide xHigh x Deep AF Unit D7000 (16) 132 x 105 x 77 CAM3500DX D7100 (24) 136 x 107 x 76 CAM4800DX D7200 (24) 136 x 107 x 76 CAM4800DX D7500 (24) 136 x 107 x 76 CAM4800DX S2 pro (6) 140 x 111 x 78 CAM900 D70 (6) 140 x 111 x 78 CAM900 D80 (10) 132 x 103 x 77 CAM1000 D90 (12) 132 x 103 x 77 CAM1000 D200 (12) 147 x 114 x 74 CAM1000 D300 (12) 147 x 114 x 74 CAM3500 D300S (12) 147 x 114 x 74 CAM3500 D600 (24) 141 x 113 x 82 CAM4800 D610 (24) 141 x 113 x 82 CAM4800 D700 (12) 147 x 123 x 77 CAM3500 D800 (36) 146 x 123 x 82 CAM3500 D810 (36) 146 x 123 x 82 CAM3500 D750 (24) 141 x 113 x 78 CAM3500 D3 (12) 160 x 157 x 88 CAM3500 D3S (12) 160 x 157 x 88 CAM3500 D4 (16) 160 x 157 x 91 CAM3500 D500 (21) 148 x 115 x 81 CAM20K D5 (21) 160 x 159 x92 CAM20K D850 (45/24/12) 146 x 124 x 79 CAM20K |
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blackfox
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What do those numbers actually equate to though Jonathon , how do you choose from those the ones that are the best for wildlife and sport and that's without bringing the lenses into the equation .. I think I already know but it could be helpful for future reference for others |
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blackfox
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Been doing a lot of browsing overnight and this windy morning and taking into account I already have the D300S which is reasonably fast and accurate .. on my budget which is not likely to increase which of these would be the best choice D300 or D700 or just stick with what I have ? |
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jk
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blackfox wrote:What do those numbers actually equate to though Jonathon , how do you choose from those the ones that are the best for wildlife and sport and that's without bringing the lenses into the equation .. OK the D5, D500, D850, Z7, Z6 use the latest AF unit which is the best that Nikon has in the market. Some may argue that it is better than other manufacturers but that is debatable as other factors also then come into play. The Z7 and Z6 being mirrorless are also slightly different as they have addition AF. I dont see any difference between AF speed and reliabillity between Z7 and D850. Test I have done with my D850 v D500 indicate to me that the D500 is more sure footed regarding AF lock on and reliability. These are my in-use tests and not in-lab scientific tests. I think this is due to the AF hot spot layout which is all over the screen rather that in the central part. So for wildlife and sports I would reach for the D500. Everything else I would go for D800, D850 or Z7. That said Graham manages very well with his D850 anf 500mm f4 for bird photography. My BIF tests were conducted with my Nikon 200-500mm f5.6 AFS VR and 300mm f2.8 AFS and 400mm f2.8 AFS. I cant see any difference in the AF speed between D800 and D850. So for speed of AF the units go CAM20K ==> CAM3500 ==> CAM4800/4800DX ==> etc.... One thing that is missing from my table is the chipset level EXPEED 5, 4, 3. This chipset makes a difference in the noise levels in images and also does tweaks to the AF and other stuff, the exact content is unknow unless you are in Nikon Japan as it is proprietary. |
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jk
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Here is a list of the same data as above but with EPEED added. D300 (12) 147 x 114 x 74 CAM3500 Expeed3 D300S (12) 147 x 114 x 74 CAM3500 Expeed3 D600 (24) 141 x 113 x 82 CAM4800 Expeed3 D610 (24) 141 x 113 x 82 CAM4800 Expeed3 D700 (12) 147 x 123 x 77 CAM3500 Expeed3 D800 (36) 146 x 123 x 82 CAM3500 Expeed3 D810 (36) 146 x 123 x 82 CAM3500 Expeed4 D750 (24) 141 x 113 x 78 CAM3500 Expeed4 D3 (12) 160 x 157 x 88 CAM3500 Expeed3 D3S (12) 160 x 157 x 88 CAM3500 Expeed3 D4 (16) 160 x 157 x 91 CAM3500 Expeed3 D500 (21) 148 x 115 x 81 CAM20K Expeed5 D5 (21) 160 x 159 x92 CAM20K Expeed5 D850 (45/24/12) 146 x 124 x 79 CAM20K Expeed5 Z7 (47) Expeed5 Z6 (24) Expeed5 |
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blackfox
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forget my above post re choices |
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jk
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Like I said Jeff. D300 then D500. I waited and waited for the D500 as there was nothing better until the D750 but that was FF. |
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blackfox
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Very nearly bought a D3 just now .. but not sure about FF for what I do , plus getting the results I want from the D300S , finding out about auto iso might help as well .. I also think the weather isn't helping , seen a video tonight of waves breaking over the top of a 200ft high cliff along the coast . Hoping on some snow this week to brighten things up |
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jk
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Check this from today in Cornwall. https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10217399229480138&set=pcb.10217399240360410&type=3&theater If you dont have Facebook then here is one for you. Attachment: 1F8012B8-90F7-4177-BF38-0E99F57785B5.jpeg (Downloaded 23 times) |
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jk
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And another. The waves are 2-4 metres high! Attachment: 076B3279-F49D-471D-AB64-7837CF4F9741.jpeg (Downloaded 23 times) |
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Iain
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blackfox wrote:forget my above post re choices If you can't afford a D500 stick with the D300s you have as the results you are producing with it are great. If you are happy with the results you are getting I would stick with 12 bit as it gives you better FPS on the D300s. It also depends on what you are using the pics for, if its just for you and you don't print them too big 12 bit will be fine. |
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blackfox
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Cheers Iain already worked that one out , changed to auto iso and the spot type metering system .. it all seems to work well together .. the D300S files seem to like lightroom and photoshop to , so it's a mix of modern lens ,old camera, modern p/p works for me anyway |
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GeoffR
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I've just bought my wife a D300 with MB-D10 as an upgrade from her D2X, no BL3 as yet so can't yet use the plethora of EN-EL4a batteries we have but it handles well. The previous owner had swapped the control dials around and reversed the meter, which was confusing in the store as neither of us could change the shutter speed in Manual. A short commune with Camera Control Pro 2 and all is now back to "Normal". We'll try Uncompressed 14 bit raw and see how she gets on. |
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